the astral, mental, and spiritual bodies around consciousness; healing a damaged charka; the lesser banishing ritual of the pentagram (LBRP); the tree of life; meridian points; navigating the various planes of existence
January 21, 2003 (workshop log file)

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Session Start: Tue Jan 21 16:35:57 2003
Session Ident: #energyworks
* Now talking in #energyworks
* Topic is 'You're not just a little wave -- you are a part of the ocean. '
* Set by Attuned! on Mon Jan 20 16:31:28
<Hermestr> howdy everyone
<Severian^> hiyo
<Electra> Greetings Hermes
<Hermestr> hi electra
<Hermestr> another full house tonight
<Electra> Not as many as last time though
<Severian^> over a year since I was here last :)
<Hermestr> yes I remember you from way back then
<Severian^> cool
<Ancient1> Hello, wish I could stay but I got to go to my martial arts class. Hope you have a good discussion.
<Hermestr> bye ancient
<Severian^> martial arts, sounds like fun !
<Ancient1> bye
<Hermestr> So Severian have you been keeping up with your self evolutionary studies?
<Severian^> well studies, of course. practice... so so :) but I have been making alot of progress
<Severian^> Do you know of Franz Bardon?
<Hermestr> I get email on him every now and then
<Severian^> oh... well I'm following his practices
<Sol1> Hello
<Hermestr> he is a magician
<Severian^> yea
<Hermestr> how is that going
<Hermestr> anything interesting you have learned?
<Severian^> I'm practicing something best described as awareness/focus of/in the subtle bodies.
<sor--> hi all
<Severian^> physical/astral/mental bodies
<Severian^> hi sor :)
<Severian^> I've learned that it can be practiced, to distinguish between them.
<sor--> hi severian:)
<Severian^> What do you think of that? I know that the astral mental body is used for example astral projection.
<Hermestr> is this during out of body states or in dreams?
<Severian^> It is a conscious meditation
<Hermestr> so you go into a light meditation and try to feel each of these bodies
<Severian^> yea that’s it
<Severian^> and to distinguish between them
<Hermestr> yes that is good to do
<EMwave> can you really call them bodies or a they actually consciousness?
<Hermestr> well when you are nonphysical they are like bodies
<Hermestr> they feel like a body anyway
<Severian^> the practice is in audio at , called self healing archaeous
<Severian^> for anyone interested
<Hermestr> when you are in your astral body it feels real and concrete
<Hermestr> I would say it is certainly a bit of both
<Hermestr> of course
<Hermestr> consciousness creates the body around you
<Hermestr> so when you are in your astral body your consciousness has created a shell around it with those qualities
<Brulaap> Good evening kids :)
<Hermestr> but then of course all these bodies exist at the same time
<Hermestr> it is merely your focus that determines which one you are tuned into
<Severian^> seems to me that it is a matter of distinguishing between them
<Severian^> kinda
<Hermestr> yes, of course it does take some skill to focus precisely on just one body
<Hermestr> in normal everyday consciousness you just slide in and out and up and down these bodies
* Severian^ nods.
<Sol1> Is it normal for the body to stiffen up during a projection?
<Hermestr> in an out of body state you won't be able to move the physical body because your consciousness is not connected to it any longer. So yea it will be stiff
<Sol1> It has happened several times, during period between sleep and dreams, I know it is coming because my body sort of contorts.
<Hermestr> yes it can happen there because in some dreams you are out of the body, and when you start to reawaken your consciousness has not yet put itself fully back in.
<sor--> Hermestr: greetings… got some questions tonight … those are the first two I hope it wll be of general interest.. You have some hint to repair damaged charka? I got 3 holes in 3rd eye charka....and do you know Aleister Crowley and his work?
<Severian^> anyone experience a crack/smack/pop sound just before?
<Sol1> Severian, I might have, not sure.
<Brulaap> I sorta had a pop sound during meditation the other day... but it also got me out of concentration
<Severian^> lol :)
<Severian^> I get it as I am about to fall asleep, or going into deep meditation. Some people get it when they project...
<Hermestr> soren: you can tie a crystal to a string and then hover it over the charka you want to heal.
<Hermestr> let it spin there for a few minutes. and while it is spinning say OH-EL-AA-PAY to call in the nonphysical surgeons to help.
<Brulaap> speaking of the OLAP surgeons, I don’t need to be in meditation in order to call them?
<Hermestr> Soren I am familiar with AC's work, though I have not studied it extensively.
<Hermestr> You can cal the OLAP in any time, no need to be in a trance to do it.
<Sol1> I have been reading up on the dreaming at wisdomsdoor. The last time, I was able to fly through walls, etc, and was completely aware, but it was still a dream world," with different surroundings. Is it possible to contact entities while in this state?
<Hermestr> Severian: just after a few hours sleep is an easy time to try to project out of the body.
<sor--> Hermestr: I found the ritual of pentagram in one of his book and I wondered:)
<Hermestr> or if you could catch yourself as you are falling off to sleep, that may bring you to the trance state, being you seem to be aware of yourself on that level.
<Severian^> I'm trying to hold on to consciousness as I fall into that, seems like it can be practiced and learned.
<Hermestr> Sol1: many dreams are out of body events, you just do not realize it, so dream data will flood itself into the OBE.
<Hermestr> sor: you wondered what about the ritual of the pentagram
<Brulaap> so basically we can have OBE's as 4 year olds without knowing really?
<Hermestr> severian: yes with practice you can catch yourself before you go to sleep and be in a perfect state for an out of body event.
<sor--> Hermestr: to find it in AC book
<Severian^> (one time I woke up and my body was snoring on me, laugh)
<Brulaap> hehe.. I sometimes have that.. that I can hear myself snore
<Severian^> funny thing
<Hermestr> burlaap: you probably had many OBE's at four years old because nobody told you that you could not.
<Brulaap> well, that's basically of what I remember when I had dreams that I could levitate and stuff
<imam> hi everyone!
<Severian^> hi
<Brulaap> hello
<Hermestr> soren: that ritual of the pentagram you are talking about is the Supreme Invoking ritual of the pentagram
<Hermestr> ?^
<sor--> lesser banishing ritual
<sor--> if I remember well
<Hermestr> ah yes well I do have the LBRP on the website
<imam> I have a question about male and female energy, why we born man or women,what is the purpose of being a women or a man on earth?
<Hermestr> Aleister Crawley may have a more elaborate version the LBRP than I have up on the web. Both will work.
<sor--> yap
<Sol1> How does one go about meeting or calling an entity whilst out of body?
<Hermestr> soren have you been using the LBRP at all? Or are you just studying ti for now?
<sor--> Hermestr: right now just studying
<Hermestr> sol1: you say "hay you!!! come over here!"
<Sol1> he.
<Brulaap> heh
<Hermestr> sor: the LBRP is light duty stuff so feel free to try it anytime you like.
<Severian^> I must honestly say that I did the LBRP as a daily practice for at least 8-10 months, and I never felt much from it.
<Sol1> Calling its name, and drawing the sigil work?
<Hermestr> It is real good to use to keep the house clear at least once a day
<sor--> oki
<sor--> if is possible I’d like to know your advice about this:
<sor--> sorry for the bad English is a lot that I don’t write:)
<sor--> I see that many esoteric teachings are symbols of unconscious...
<sor--> I try to explain..
<sor--> maybe Sephira spheres are hide part of our subconscious that we need to explore to 'grow' ascend..
<sor--> astral plane can be our subconscious populated by universal archetypes
<sor--> and alchemy and esoterism can be an 'ancient' psychology science.
<sor--> Maybe the ascension is to pacificate and unite our consciousness and subconscious
<sor--> eh.. sorry the flood:)
<Hermestr> Sol1: you can just concentrate on who you want to meet and then walk through a door or wall and you should be transported there.
<Mistery1> Mr. Hermes I read that there are discarnate entities that for some reason support certain systems of thought I.e.: communism, capitalism, or democracy etc and who incite humans as much as they can to support these thought systems as well
<sor--> hope it can be of any sense
<Sol1> Ok. Thank you. Time is short during excursions so I have to act fast.
<sor--> btw.. the are so many way to see the same thing:)
<Severian^> I agree sor--
<Hermestr> soren: yes ascension is the union of all your bodies into one body.
<Brulaap> now I’ve never seen a spirit guide.. or not to my knowledge at least... how can I recognize one in a meditation or so? (for now I stick to practicing in meditation first and contacting spirit guide before going to OBE's)
<Hermestr> Sol1: you could also draw the sigil of the person you want to meet but I think mentally just focusing on them is much easier to do in an out of body state.
<Hermestr> Mistery1: Yes of course, there are, there is also real people that do the same.
<Hermestr> whether or not you are physical you still are a person with beliefs and needs and wants.
<Hermestr> people who have died are just living in a different dimension, they take all their good, bad, and ugly with them when they go.
<Sol1> I was able to transport myself, with difficulty, to an old friends living room, by focusing, which I was quite proud of, but it only lasted a second or two, and then I must have lost awareness. Whether it was really his living room or not, I am unsure.
<Hermestr> Brulaap: if you devote one or two of your mediations to meeting your spirit guide, you will most likely see him or her in a vision in your meditation. Spirit guides usually take some human like form but they can also appear as an animal or as energy
<Severian^> sor--: My feeling of the tree of life is that it is about polarities, and how we can neutralize them within ourselves.
<sor--> Severian^: I agree
<Brulaap> ok :)
<sor--> Severian^: lately I have the feeling of 'seeing' the lessons of life
<sor--> Severian^: I mean I’m conscious of what is happening to me is to teach me something or to neutralize some old internal block
<Severian^> that’s cool
<sor--> Another thing I noticed is that when I create my world... I flow..
<sor--> it seems we are like a TV that need to be tuned on a good frequency
<Sol1> sorry for interrupting
<sor--> at last creating world is just ..using our will
<Severian^> yea the tree is filled with lots of archetypes related to humanity, there to explore
<sor--> I mean.. if I don’t have a work is because inside I don't want a work
<sor--> Severian^: yapp
<Severian^> I have a question about meridians... or "energy" lanes in the body... do you use them Hermes?
<Hermestr> severian: yes that is the main purpose of the tree of life, to expose you to different energy patterns that will help to dissolve the blockages you have inside you.
<Hermestr> Sol1: yes it takes great focus to stay someplace nonphysically. More so just a few moments after you have finished traveling to that spot.
<Severian^> I had an awesome session with a 'PEAT' instructor, that was about dissolve energy while touching these energy lanes.
<Severian^> (peat is an energy therapy)
<Hermestr> Severian, I do use these points for self healing if that is what you are asking
<Sol1> Sorry, my connection was lagged
<Severian^> Around the eyes, and just above the solar plexus, were the ones we used.
<Severian^> I'm curious how they work, and what they are for. :)
<Hermestr> Soren: yes you create everything in your world. So if you don't have work than inside you do not want to work. So to make work all you have to do is change how you feel about work and then it will be created.
<Hermestr> Severian it depends on what those points connect too in the body how they will effect you.
<sor--> Hermestr: I know you said it over and over... but now I feel it. is the reality. if I don’t have a woman, is because I don't want a woman.. and so for everything
<sor--> :)
<Severian^> okay
<Hermestr> I can't seem to find my meridian map
<Hermestr> so I could look those points up
* Severian^ snaps his finger.
<Severian^> s..
<Severian^> :)
<Severian^> I felt kinda silly tapping these points, but the effects were awesome.
<Severian^> sor--: Do you ever walk up the "chain" of reasons for how you feel about things? That helps me sometimes, to find "higher" reasons.
<Hermestr> yes the body has all these connecting points
<Hermestr> they are like remote activation switches
<Hermestr> you press something here and it changes some thing there
<Hermestr> for example I remember this one
<Severian^> hehe
<Hermestr> for a headache
<Hermestr> you press between your thumb and forefinger gently with your other thumb and forefinger
<Severian^> between, like in the space between?
<Hermestr> the key to this one however is to do it before the headache gets to be real bad
<Hermestr> yea the space between them
<Hermestr> I believe
<Hermestr> without my map from memory
<sor--> Severian^: no...explain better:)
<sor--> Severian^: sometimes higher reasons are so unreachable
<Severian^> I believe that all problems emanate from "higher" problems, and so on.
<Severian^> and that solving a higher problem could be better than getting stuck at the lower one, sometimes
<Severian^> thanks Hermes, I'll try to remember that one :)
<EMwave> when out of body what is your thinking logic like? for example can you do math or criticize things?
<sor--> Severian^: see.. the more I try to climb up the chain
<sor--> Severian^: the more I need to be.. disentificated from myself
<Severian^> btw, on the subject of forefingers and thumbs, I have a small tip related to dowsing, if anyone is interested
<sor--> Severian^: I need to be in a state of observation of myself
<Hermestr> emwave: to do any kind of higher thinking like that you would have to be in your mental body and on the mental plane
<sor--> Severian^: I noticed that in that state I’m more free.. because I look at myself doing things, but I’m not myself
<EMwave> so you can't in the astral plane?
<Severian^> sor--: my experience is that it is very useful to take that approach that you describe
<Severian^> sor--: as long as it isn’t just mental pictures
<sor--> Severian^: yes
<sor--> Severian^: is not so easy
<Hermestr> emwave: it is very hard to think about numbers and counting on the astral plane, that is a plane of emotions, feelings and desires.
<sor--> Severian^: I need to give attention to myself without being ..myself, or thinking too much about what I do, speak etc..
<sor--> Severian^: difficult to explain hope you catch the concept:)
<Severian^> sor--: thinking always gets in the way :)
<Severian^> sor--: the way I do it, is trying to experience both opposites of the problem at the same time, emotionally and mentally
<Severian^> sor--: sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t
<sor--> Severian^: cool approach
<sor--> Severian^: I’m trying to give minus importance to the brain, cause sometimes it fails,it say a lot of lies:9
<Severian^> sor--: he he
<Sol1> Hermes, how does one know which plane they are on?
<Sol1> I read the astral and etheric sections of your dream articles.
<sor--> Severian^: a thing that help me is to accept what is going on, whatever it is bad or good things.. accept and observe, without reading blocks
<sor--> C
<sor--> :)
<Severian^> sor--: my biggest problem is that I get caught up in logic and rational thinking, a big problem
<sor--> Severian^: yeah.. same:)
<Hermestr> Sol1: basically by what you are doing there. Your thoughts and or emotions at the time will determine which plane you are on. For example if you are feeling a bit romantic, you most certainly will find yourself on the astral plane expressing that emotion. If you want to solve some kind of problem you may find yourself on the mental plane.
<sor--> Severian^: did you do exercise to stop flow of thoughts? Meditation can help
<Severian^> sor--: yes, I'm doing it alot, it also helps alot
<Sol1> Yes, yes, I *do* in fact notice a difference in the intensity of emotion sometimes.
<Sol1> Sometimes, emotion seems completely absent, while other times it is intense.
<Severian^> sor--: for my personality, that is the most beneficial practice of them all
<sor--> Severian^: also breathing is good.. help to focus in the present moment Zen speaking, or now moment hermes speaking:)
<sor--> here and how
<sor--> :)
<sor--> now
* Severian^ nods.
<Sol1> That is partly why I asked about calling an entity. I do not want to waste my time calling a spirit that doesn’t' even reside on the plane that I am on.
<Severian^> sor--: I agree, perception is everything. I wouldn’t trade 10 seconds of no-thought for any book.
<sor--> Severian^: agree completely
<Hermestr> Sol1: well if you think about who you want to meet and then walk through a wall or door, you should be transported to whatever plane they reside on.
<Sol1> .
<Sol1> Hmm, I never thought of it that way.
<Sol1> Being transported to where they are.
<Hermestr> it is always better to visit a being in his or her own environment when possible
<Hermestr> you can call them down to your reality plane, but the other way is just better maners.
<EMwave> when out of body how do you accept walking through a wall but not at the same time falling through the floor, its the same thing?
<Sol1> As far as my experience. You walk through the wall because you *want* to walk through the wall. If you wanted to fall through the floor you could.
<EMwave> you must be criticizing your actions?
<Hermestr> emwave: well good point, but it is all about will and what you want to do. Being you do not want to fall through the floor you will not.
<Severian^> I have a funny little tip (totally unrelated to astral travel!) I'd like to share, if anyone is interested.
<Sol1> Why is it that sometimes, out of body I feel very weak, and even "all asleep"?
<sor--> Severian^: yap
<Sol1> fall asleep
<Severian^> sor--: Okay, if you are out shopping for fresh fruit (an example), finding the best fruit might be difficult.
<Severian^> sor--: So, you can pick one out, and ask out loud "Is this fruit good?".
<Severian^> sor--: And get the answer by rubbing your forefinger against your thumb.
<Hermestr> Sol1: you are either not focused enough on the reality plane you are on, or you do not have enough energy with you. You should be doing two MPE's a day to have real good strong OBE's.
<Severian^> sor--: If you sense much friction, the answer is no.
<Severian^> sor--: If you don't sense friction at all, the answer is yes.
<Hermestr> nice tip
<Severian^> sor--: I think it works along the same lines as a pendulum, you ask your subconscious what it thinks.
<sor--> Severian^: nice:)you can use it for everything?
<Severian^> yea
<sor--> usually I ask my sub
<sor--> and I feel the answer
<Severian^> cool. you dont need fingers then ;)
<sor--> Severian^: it helped me a lot when I was in school.. to know if I’ll be interrogated next day;)
<Sol1> Hermes, I take note of that, thank you.
<Severian^> sor--: he he
<Sol1> I was certain it had something to do with lack of energy.
<Hermestr> ok got to go, see everyone on this Thursday.
* Disconnected
Session Close: Tue Jan 21 17:58:24 2003

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