January 18, 2001 (workshop log file)

dreaming of famous people; dreaming of the future; god-consciousness and the present moment; group meditation with adventures; your perfect center spot in Malkuth and what happens when you leave it; the power of dreams; changing the past

January 18, 2001 (workshop log file)

Session Start: Thu Jan 18 16:41:13 2001
*** Now talking in #energyworks
*** Topic is 'Astral Projection, Lucid Dreams and more, are yours to explore!'
<Hermes`> howdy people of great origin
<Amazed> hey!
<Hermes`> And I hope everyone is doing fine
<MagicMan> hey hermes
<MagicMan> that's a new one..
<Hermes`> yea, got to keep you on your toes
<Hermes`> okay did anything exciting go on this week
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<SoulFlyFr> Hey everyone
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<Hermes`> welcome
<MagicMan> hi iwonder
<MagicMan> hi soulflyr
<iWonder> hi Magic
<iWonder> hi Amzed
<iWonder> hi there Hermes
<Amazed> is it true that when you dream of some famous person it's because you want some quality of that person?
<SoulFlyFr> Hi
<Hermes`> yea, that is sometimes true
<Hermes`> it also could mean you had a nice dream with that famous person
<MagicMan> well...I was hoping to talk about this on tuesday...guess now is a good time as any...
<iWonder> hi SoulFly
<Amazed> wasn't a really nice person heh
<Hermes`> oh
<SoulFlyFr> Hey I wonder..
<Amazed> it was a lucid dream btw
<SoulFlyFr> How did you induce the lucid dream Amazed?
<Amazed> Soul: well I dreamt I woke up in my parents sbed where I never sleep, so I realized it's a dream
<SoulFlyFr> Ahh! Quite a shock to find ya self in your mum and dads bed!
<Hermes`> I don't think you were gunning for that kind of personality energy within yourself
<Amazed> yea me neither :)
<Amazed> and I woke up right after that
<Amazed> and for some reason wanted and tried to get back in the dream but couldn't
<MagicMan> I had a dream where I had a seizure in it
<Hermes`> yea magicman that don't sound pleasant
<MagicMan> well at least got your attention :)
<Amazed> yes I'm done Magic
<MagicMan> here's the short version of what happened in the dream: <MagicMan> well ... there was I person I know there waiting for a medium person and I kinda joked about the whole thing...and kicked a scoreboard plate ...I kicked it..It landed with a number: 58. then I started having these seizures in the dreams for a while then I woke up.
<SoulFlyFr> I remember once I had a dream I was living in the future, and the atmosphere outside was clouded with sulfur smoke and hundreds of tractors and construction work going on. Anyway, I couldn't breath because of the sulfur smoke. I awoke to find my face in my pillow! That was a realistic dream..
<Hermes`> so the message is don't kick the crap out of 58 and you will be fine
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<MagicMan> the number only appeared after I kicked it and landed standing (showing 58)
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<Hermes`> SoulFlyFr perhaps it was a future dream. In dreams we can travel forward and backward in time and do so often.
<MagicMan> the seizures started with "explosion" noises coming from what seemed to be my left inner hear
<SoulFlyFr> I quite believe that ya know.. I wouldn't be surprised if we will be breathing from oxygen tanks 150 years from now. Human civilization is killing the world..
<Hermes`> magicman, perhaps that dream is suggesting you take something in your life more serious that you would normally just treat as a joke
<Hermes`> It also could be on another planet too, like some sort of future teraforming project
<Hermes`> but those kinds of future dreams to warn of things that could be, and serve as a way to stop these things from happening, by planting the seeds within consciousness to avoid creating it.
<MagicMan> I don't see the relation but ok...thats fair enough
<MagicMan> enough
<SoulFlyFr> Nearly everyone on this planet is too absent minded to see the changes that must be made to save the world
<Hermes`> well people, like the planet change slowly.
<SoulFlyFr> Lets just hope it goes for the best
<Hermes`> yea
<gnosis-> Hermes, what is the relationship between god-consciousness and the present moment?
<Hermes`> magicman the number 58 must be a clue as to what this incident in your life is.
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<GargowL> Merry Meet
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<SoulFlyFr> Hi gar
<xor--> hi ppl
<MagicMan> yes Im looking out for it
<MagicMan> hi soren
<MagicMan> hi I'm
* iWonder full house tonight ?
<Gargowl> seems so
<Hermes`> gnosis, well within the present moment is god, and of course if you can tune into this perfect part of the moment you can then make your thoughts one with god
<SoulFlyFr> Age 58.. Be warned
<MagicMan> lol heheeh
<MagicMan> more like don't make the same mistake 58 times
<Hermes`> yikes,
<Hermes`> that is slow learning
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<gnosis-> Hermes, have you heard of John Wren-Luis?
<iWonder> hi Iris
<iris^> Hi everyone!
<Hermes`> gnosis, no I have not
<xor--> hi iris
<gnosis-> Is this kind of consciousness the kind you are familiar with: http://www.wie.org/j8/dazdark.html
<SoulFlyFr> Hey, anyone know if PureHeart has her website up yet?
* Amazed is PureHeart
<Amazed> heh
<Amazed> and no I gave up on that
* iWonder you would be Amazed
<SoulFlyFr> Ohh Hi! Sorry, I didn't know you changed your name!
<Amazed> but I'll write you my method if you still want it?
<SoulFlyFr> Frustrating doing a website?
<SoulFlyFr> Sure, please go ahead
<Hermes`> gnosis, okay yes that is one form of tuning into the god-consciousness. However that kind of NDE experience is meant to show the individual what it is they need to learn how to tune into. Thus these experiences tend to be powerful. In time however and with practice you can learn how to tune into this god-consciousness every moment. Of course this kind of connection is more subtle.
<SoulFlyFr> What exactly does subtle mean?!
<Hermes`> gnosis, your god-connection should be like a quiet beautiful song being constantly played in the background of your mind.
<Hermes`> sub·tle (s¾t“l) adj. sub·tler, sub·tlest. 1.a. So slight as to be difficult to detect or analyze; elusive. b. Not immediately obvious; abstruse. 2. Able to make fine distinctions. 3.a. Characterized by skill or ingenuity; clever. b. Crafty or sly; devious. c. Operating in a hidden, usually injurious way; insidious. --sub“tle·ness n. --sub“tly adv.
<SoulFlyFr> Ahh.. I thought so
<MagicMan> you gotta teach me how you do that hermes :)
<Hermes`> ah you mean my fast dictionary type typing skill
<Hermes`> amazing isn't it
<gnosis-> :)
<MagicMan> yea well be sure to schedule the med soon
<Hermes`> oh yea
<Hermes`> okay who is in for the meditation
* xor-- in 5 mins
<Amazed> ah Soren always you :)
<SoulFlyFr> * hand up *
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<iris^> whenever everyone's ready I'm set to go :)
<MagicMan> yea well ok to go
<xor--> Amazed:setting up environment:)
<iWonder> I will skip the meditation today
<iris^> :(
<MagicMan> come on man this is your chance to get off the work for a bit
<gnosis-> I'm in
<gnosis-> quick question hermes
<Hermes`> sure then we go
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<gnosis-> what do you know of a state of consciousness where it seems like spatial awareness expands
*** GamBot_ sets mode: +o jsn
<gnosis-> like it seems like everything becomes superspacious
<Hermes`> well as you approach the conditions where your body and spirit separate that happens.
<SoulFlyFr> I have that every time I meditate. Feels real weird
<Hermes`> or of course deep relaxation
<gnosis-> ok
<xor--> ok,ready
<Hermes`> okay let's begin
<iris^> ok
* MagicMan gone
* Hermes` hermes is ohmming
* Hermes` had a phone call then the people at the door, so he did not get to do the meditation
* MagicMan back
<MagicMan> gee what luck hermes
<Hermes`> yea
<MagicMan> well as long as no one returned yet I might as well spill it out
<Hermes`> it's okay as Iris usually can pick up on what was going on real well
* iWonder I wasn´t here I was eating my lettuce salad
<Hermes`> yea go ahead magicman you start
<MagicMan> first I got lizard men with spears and some body armor
<MagicMan> then some roman buildings and roman soldiers running around riding horses and those chariots
<MagicMan> later I saw the coliseum
<MagicMan> then I lost those images and got a burning candle getting some wind and stopped then got lit again somehow and all was dark around
<MagicMan> I tried moving around to find an exit
<MagicMan> found a door...opened it and I was at some alley
<MagicMan> there was a sign next to the door kinda looked like the hermes symbol at the website.
<MagicMan> then I got interrupted for 2min
<MagicMan> got back and picked up on the door again...continued on walking the street there some soturn atmosphere dogs howlling...ah there was also some sign next to that other door that seemed like a crystal ball
<gnosis-> I'm back
<MagicMan> then I entered another door which was an inn ...the innkeeper invited me in and offered me a drink. he chat a bit and he said he I was not around much outside or something and why was I out? and I said it was dark inside...bla bla I said hey you don't get much customers do you? and he said no...
<MagicMan> the inn was decorated with a painting all else was wooden and the walls were of stone
<MagicMan> that's about it
<MagicMan> the in keeper was bulky looking
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<MagicMan> or this is very accurate or I'm very good at making stuff up :)
<Gargowl> hmm... seems like some excessive medieval RPG playing lately... ;P
<MagicMan> actually no
<MagicMan> reminds me of UO but I have not played it for several months
<Hermes`> well the inn keeper could have a quest for you or hold something for you to learn
<Hermes`> your search through various doors brings you to this person
<MagicMan> I don't think so...he was just idly there
<Hermes`> is it possible these doors represented some tree of life spheres
<MagicMan> <MagicMan> the drink sounded (cuz I couldn't really taste [duh]) like something honey like sweet
<MagicMan> <MagicMan> I probably entered this place because it was at the end of the street eheh
<MagicMan> <MagicMan> now does this match anything to the astral shop?
<SoulFlyFr> hermesz.. you carry a Z
<Hermesz> yea the other was taken by my still connected self
<MagicMan> ah in the roman setting I also one guy who had a helmet and his face was fly like
<Gargowl> therefore the mask ;)
<MagicMan> no mask...just one of those helmet that don't cover the face
<Gargowl> oh...
<Gargowl> he should wear one then.. a fly face must freak out ppl...
<Hermesz> so magicman your adventure had two parts. one the roman part and the other a more Camelot like part.
<MagicMan> well he doesn't have to have if I made him up
<MagicMan> which I don't know lol these are so vague
<MagicMan> is there such a place anywhere with a HT symbol on it?
<Hermesz> well I often get the feeling with some of your meditation adventures that they are parts of past lives you have had.
<Hermesz> In Camelot
<Hermesz> yea my office
<Hermesz> I'm never there thought
<Hermesz> though
<MagicMan> yea lol
<MagicMan> excluding that one
<MagicMan> what do you feel is a part of a past life?
<Hermesz> just intuition with some of your adventures, no particular reason
<Amazed> then why do you have an office
<MagicMan> and what part do you feel is part of my imagination btw? :)
<Hermesz> of course at times past lives can be important to help solve a present problem
<Hermesz> they gave me that office when they made me captain of the guard
<gnosis-> all of it is your imagination
<MagicMan> thanks for the insight gnosis...
<Hermesz> perhaps this roman landscape is something to help you now in your life.
<gnosis-> I don't mean it is illusory
<Gargowl> gotta go
<SoulFlyFr> How do you know all the in information received in a meditation has any relevance to lessons in life? I was just wondering because its one of the things that is bugging me
<Gargowl> Farewell and Blessed Be!
<MagicMan> see you I'm
<MagicMan> well I think ur done with me ...next
<iris^> bye for now I'm
<Hermesz> well in a very strict sense anything that happens to you is important to you now in some way. these meditations are perhaps a bit more intense and are geared to teaching you all how to use this power.
*** I'm (AskMe_@195-23-222-32.nr.ip.pt) Quit (So what if it's dangerous? If I get hurt my wounds shall heal, and if I perish..)
<Hermesz> so I try to consider what everyone experiences in these meditations as important in some way
<gnosis-> dreams can just be fun, they don't always have to be revelations
<iris^> many times I was told they were exercises for us
<MagicMan> yes how about you iris? soren? amazed? soulflyfr? gnosis?
<SoulFlyFr> I would sur like to lucid dream, but I'm not sure how.
<SoulFlyFr> Hermes.. all I got during meditation was a vision of me sitting in the mountains by a beautiful river surrounded by so much inspiration
<SoulFlyFr> like flowers, wildlife and crystal clear water
<Amazed> wow that's nice
<gnosis-> soulflyfr...start remember and paying attention to your dreams...like say, when you are waking in the morning.
<Gnosis> or trying to remember them later in the day
<SoulFlyFr> gn - since I started regular meditation, I've had amazing dream recall.. Mostly everyday I remember them with great clarity
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<Hermesz> soulflyfr perhaps that is a perfect balance place you can return to in meditations and dreams. A place where you are in perfect harmony with everything that exists
<Hermesz> have you been to this place before?
<SoulFlyFr> Man, many many times before.. I day dream about being there.. And always when I listen to my music.
<SoulFlyFr> Its like a little sanctuary within my mind. An ultimate place I would like to visit in the physical
<SoulFlyFr> * place
<SoulFlyFr> I think it comes from meditation on hill tops. I do that sometimes. You can feel allot of energy up there
<Hermesz> well then keep that place special and return to it to gain your connection to the universe whenever you feel that waver.
<SoulFlyFr> ( I live in the woods )
<Hermesz> nice place to live
<SoulFlyFr> Its real nice here, yeh. Its a break from the materialistic
<MagicMan> well see you all
<xor--> bye magic
<SoulFlyFr> See ya Magic
<iris^> bye magic
<Hermesz> bye magicman
<Hermesz> okay who's next
<Hermesz> with their meditation highlights
<iWonder> bye magic
<Amazed> I saw just one image, someone on a horse on this meadow with wonderful flowers
*** MagicMan (magicman@213.190.201.85) Quit ("I told myself it was over but motion is seductive and how can I resist feeling )
<Amazed> but in the middle of the meditation I started feeling real nice and happy
<Amazed> and at the end I felt like two someone's above me sending me this big wave of energy
<Amazed> was really nice, and that's all
<Hermesz> maybe that place was part of where Soulflyfr was
<iris^> in the beginning and end of my med everyone was in a meadow
<xor--> meadow?
<xor--> means?
<Amazed> when I think of it, I'm always on a meadow :)
<iris^> brb - someone is at my door :)
<SoulFlyFr> Amazed.. This maybe is like my special place too.. Something to come home too.
<Hermesz> mead·ow (mµd“½) n. A tract of grassland, either in its natural state or used as pasture or for growing hay. --mead“ow·y adj.
<xor--> tnx HDictionary:)
<Hermesz> :)
<Hermesz> in Malkuth we all have what is called our perfect place or natural center
<Hermesz> in meditation and sometimes in dreams you can find this place..
<Hermesz> many of your adventures can start from this perfect place
<Hermesz> also if you are lucky enough to know what direction you are traveling from this perfect place it will tell you a bit about the adventure you are about to embark on
<Hermesz> for example..
<Hermesz> North -- Karmic forces
<Hermesz> East -- Desire and emotional forces
<Hermesz> South -- Silence and forces of inertia
<Hermesz> West -- Limiting and restrictive forces
<Hermesz> so if I was to travel north from my perfect place in Malkuth I would embark on an adventure that would put me in contact with the karma I am carrying and must get rid of
<Hermesz> the east would tell me what desires and emotional forces control me
<Hermesz> south is the hidden or silent things that drive me
<Hermesz> and the west is the things in myself that limit me from getting what I want
<SoulFlyFr> Are you putting this on the Library Chat log because I would really like to save this.. amnd I have to go. Thanks for the help on perfect places.. I will find out what direction I am heading
<Amazed> but how can you know to which side you go?
<Hermesz> yea I'll post it
<Hermesz> it does not matter which way you go, just that it helps to know which way you are going
<SoulFlyFr> Nice one!
<SoulFlyFr> Thanks everyone. Nice talking.. buh bye
<xor--> bye Soul
<Hermesz> bye soul
<iWonder> bye Soul
<Amazed> but how can you tell "I was on the north"?
<Amazed> see you Soul
*** SoulFlyFr (+S2e1geu@ACA31C72.ipt.aol.com) Quit (Leaving)
<iWonder> I once was in Tex, I think
<Amazed> or do you just *know*?
<Hermesz> well if you ask the question to yourself usually when you are in the adventure, you can get a sense of where your perfect place is in relation to where you are now.
<iWonder> I started on a beach, and went up a bit...
<Amazed> oh right!
<Hermesz> or you can just get up from your perfect place and just start walking
<Hermesz> right iwonder
<Hermesz> which direction did that take you?
<iWonder> up in front of me
<iWonder> in a split I was with my ex wife and my children
<iWonder> ...they were babies, and I left, couldn't´t handle such strong feelings
<iWonder> ...kept going up, and found myself in a working place
<Hermesz> could be the East
<iWonder> ...there was a guy there who said, my shift is off will you take over
<iWonder> I all saw was computer like machines, so I agreed
<iWonder> in a split I understood what I thought should be easy for me to handle, wasn´t at all
<iWonder> somethings happened after this, and at last I went down to the beach again
<iWonder> a lot of friends were waiting and asked me, are we going to that party, or not
<iWonder> I agreed ( though I'm not a party guy) so we went right
<iWonder> one of them said, why are you carrying that ridiculous gun and that rusty sword ?
<iWonder> I realized then I had to let go of anger and aggressively
<iWonder> I dropped the belt...and waked up
<iWonder> :(
<iWonder> never got to the party
<iWonder> that's it
<Hermesz> well it sounds like a nice lesson there
<Hermesz> most likely the East if I had to say a direction
<iris^> similar to some stuff I got in med too
<iris^> couldn't figure it out
<iris^> like the workshop and the gun?
<iris^> but I think you put it nicely
<iris^> in letting go of anger :)
<xor--> nice med wonder..
<xor--> I had something too
<Hermesz> anger is a strange emotion. It hides within you in cubicles you are dimly aware of
<iris^> go ahead, xor
<Hermesz> and then one day you turn the right key and it comes out
<Hermesz> oh yea go soren
<Hermesz> I'll just keep blabbing
<xor--> at first some old planes
<iris^> I had them too!
<xor--> world war style
<xor--> and some mice
<xor--> later a great gate,later on 2 old ppl
<xor--> or well,just one of that ppl was old,he was like the Heremit of the tarots
<xor--> the other one was a she dress with a monk dress
<xor--> dressed
<xor--> then I thought to saw Camelot,from a great height
<xor--> seemed an island
<xor--> another interesting vision was that
<xor--> 2 cup with a sword near every cup
<xor--> then some spare wolves:)
<xor--> that's is
<xor--> t
<iris^> fits in with things in my med too
<xor--> what happened in your med iris?
<Hermesz> 2- old people 2-cups 2-swords 2-warewolves ?
<Hermesz> I see a pattern
<iris^> well, at first I met the magician (Hermit card)
<iris^> and we went to a meadow - everyone was there
<iris^> just doing their own thing - having a nice time
<iris^> then I saw what I thought was a golfer but I think he was a fisherman
<iris^> just the side of him in a plaid shirt
<iris^> then I was in a workshop or machine shop
<iris^> there was an elf there - I remember his green shoes!
<iris^> he said something but I don't remember what
<iris^> then I was back in the meadow
<iris^> I started to rise above the meadow with two others
<iris^> I thought they were soren and iwinder
<iris^> (iwonder)
<iris^> we went higher than the clouds
<xor--> Hermesz:dunno the wolves the other were 2
<iris^> then we were moving next to an old WW I or II plane
<xor--> iris^:got the cup thing in the sky
<xor--> iris^:u went through some tunnel?
<iris^> we were passing over a beach or desert - all I remember was seeing sandy ground
<iris^> I felt like I was traveling in a tunnel with this plane and these two ppl
<iris^> the cup with the swords?
<xor--> yes
<iris^> wow what can it mean?
<xor--> amazing,got desert too
<iris^> whoever was in the plane was shooting at the ground
<iris^> for a minute I thought it meant fighting in the Mid East
<iris^> I couldn't make sense of it cause I never get shooting
<Hermesz> two of swords is the beginning of hostility; the two of cups the beginning of a romance or friendship
<xor--> minor arcana?
<Hermesz> yea
<iris^> lots of 2's today - partnerships?
<xor--> yeah cups symbolize emotion..
<iris^> yeah
<iris^> well, we started coming back down into the meadow
<iris^> strong white light energy showered down over us
<iris^> then we were back in the meadow and that's all I remember
<iris^> ???????????
<xor--> I got a lot of energy
<xor--> mostly arms and hands
<Amazed> yep me too
<xor--> but at the start of med
<iris^> humm
<Hermesz> soren and Iris's meds seem to be very much linked these days
<iris^> the feelings throughout the med were very nice
<Hermesz> perhaps that means that each of your meditations has more to do with something outside yourselves, perhaps global
<iris^> yeah, both soren's and iwonder's, and amazed meadow too
<Hermesz> yea iwonder too
<iris^> I always feel like we are working on something
<iris^> don't know if that "something" is within or without us
<iris^> (something)
<Hermesz> well it was just a thought. it just could be what the group is currently learning
<iris^> the Mid East feeling was strong so who knows :)
<iris^> and what about the workshop?
<iris^> machine shop?
<iris^> we went there to get work?
<iWonder> I've tried to get there over and over
<iris^> to the Mid East?
<iWonder> no, to the workshop
<Hermesz> well I suppose the point being to this, is that you should never feel that you can not do anything to change the world...
<Hermesz> because the things you do in dreams and in these kinds of meditations all have an effect on things much larger than you think.
<Iris^> multilevels :)
<Hermesz> yea, exactly
<Hermesz> events often form first on the nonphysical
<iWonder> mental plane ?
<Hermesz> so a key to stopping something from manifesting can lie in doing some dream or OBE work on it
<Hermesz> yea the mental plane is one where these things take shape
<iWonder> if the event is emotional driven, could the astral plane be the origin ?
<Hermesz> yep
<Amazed> what about undoing something that happened? cause since the beginning of this year almost every night I had this dreams of past events.. And I felt like that dreams in a way changed my thoughts and feeling about that past situations
<Hermesz> yes, you can go into a dream enter the past and change what happened. Then what occurs is your feelings toward that situation will change
<Hermesz> you release the energy and heal it
<Hermesz> so even though the event occurred, the energy connected to it no longer is there or out of balance
<Hermesz> and everyone connected to it will heal
<iWonder> ah
<iWonder> now I get it
<iWonder> I wasn't quite understanding the past changing part
<iWonder> now it seems clear
<gnosis-> audios
*** gnosis- (userid@one103.ptsi.net) has left #energyworks (gnosis-)
<Hermesz> some of this healing the past work still continues with incidents that happened in WW2. groups of nonphysical people go back in time to help heal that past to help those people trapped by what happened then to let it go.
<Hermesz> you can do the same with your own lives
<Hermesz> and when asked to help others
*** xor-- (~soren@62.98.164.53) Quit (Ping timeout)
<iWonder> it's more dealing with the cause, rather than fighting the effects
<iWonder> the karmic energy wave from past events...
<Hermesz> yes it does involve that
<Hermesz> of course all your actions have ripple effects to it
<Hermesz> and what you did in the past can ripple out to the present to effect your reality
<Hermesz> so changing that past will remove those ripples and free up your present from that karma
<iWonder> most of the times we say, if I knew then what know now, wouldn't have done it
<Hermesz> yea
<iWonder> this must be a lesson which has been learned
<Hermesz> yes and learned lessons no longer require that karmic wave around
<Hermesz> so get rid of it
<Hermesz> let's face it, if you can look back at a past action and know you would want to change it, then you must of learned the lesson
<Hermesz> so the only step here left is the removal of the karmic energy
<iWonder> I get it
<Hermesz> oh well
<Hermesz> time to call it quits for tonight
<iWonder> yah, 1:00 am here
<Hermesz> good session. I'll catch everyone next week
<iris^> very interesting session
<Hermesz> as always
<Hermesz> night all
<iWonder> bye everyone
Session Close: Thu Jan 18 20:07:31 2001